Tenth Period | Why Teach Social Studies in a Crisis?

0:03 hello and welcome everyone to 10th period Bill of Rights Institute webinar series my name is Kirk Higgins on the senior manager of education at the Bill of Rights Institute and I am joined by my two colleagues Gary and Rachel hello thanks for having us so fun and we are coming to you live really live today and we’re hoping to have a casual conversation about education and sort of the nature of Education and what we’ve been thinking about particularly during the kovat 19 pandemic crisis because it’s caused all of us to kind of take a step back and really reflect on what it is that we’re doing as educators and the work that we’re doing to educate and and what all of that means and it’s

0:49 something we’ve been talking about internally and so we thought it would be great if we just brought that conversation out into the open and had it with you all and so with that Gary and Rachel I’ll kind of kick things off by thinking about a couple words so I so etymology is that was really interesting to me and I think particularly in education words are really a way of opening up a door for me like I remember it was a moment of in my educational journey that like when I realized that words weren’t just things that I was having to fill out onto a paper to reach the number of pages I needed to to finish an assignment but we’re actually really powerful was eye-opening for me and so as I was getting ready for this conversation I was thinking about the word college because although you know

1:36 we mainly work in the high school space in a sense high schools our colleges to a certain extent in that word college is is one that’s really interesting to me because it it comes from the Latin root which means partnership or all together I mean so there’s a sense that that this educational journey that we’re on is in fact a partnership with our students and with our fellow colleagues and in that together we are working towards an end of becoming more educated but it’s not just something we’re dictating to our students everybody in that partnership has a role and we’re all participating in it so I thought I’d start there and just get everyone’s thoughts and then we can see where the conversation takes us yeah can I can I jump in first with that I think I think

2:22 your word or college and partnership is a really good starting point because I think what we’re facing right now is that concept of what it means to be together because there’s physical together which is very obvious but then there’s like this conceptual togetherness that I think we’re working through so that partnership idea that that back and forth is is now a time to to revisit that what does that mean and I like that you started with analyzing a word because I I guess I’ve been thinking about that for this conversation as well the word essential it’s a word that’s coming up a lot during this period and often refer to in terms of business or parts of society

3:09 that are essential but I think of it for two reasons one what the nature of the word is itself and and I’m excited to talk about this because if we do love philosophical things and so I think of my Aristotle and other things in terms of so there’s there’s what is the essence of a thing is sort of in a mutable concept it’s a it’s a conceptual thing and it’s a really interesting thing to think about because it allows for so much variation right so if I and I’m just gonna toss it out there we haven’t discussed this ahead of time but you know if you were to toss out the idea of oranges bananas apples essentially they are fruit right we kind

3:56 of categorized there’s something to them and so getting down to what what connects these things together which I think brings to the other point which is school hasn’t actually ended right now right education has not stopped it it continues even though the coming together has been on pause what is essential to education is that happening and if so like what does that mean what does that look like and I guess the essential parts but I think about our you know that education happens what that is contained and now what is that the content of that education and then how it occurs so I think in this conversation it’s interesting having less answers fewer

4:43 answers and more more questions but that’s good in a way like what I what I really appreciate about what’s happening right now is it really there’s this idea of economics called a demonstrated preference that what you do it shows what your highest order preference is because that’s what you’re that’s what you’re choosing with your scarce resources and time to do there is we are demonstrating preferences about what we think is essential in education and I think let’s one of the things that is coming out of this crisis is yes as you said Gary education and we have to we still haven’t defined that word yet it is essential because it was no one’s thought was that you would just stop all

5:30 you know educational activity the same way that you stopped all barber shop app activity right so barber shop activity at some point was just we’re not no one is doing that anymore it was never a concept in in in communities that you would stop all educational activity there would be some sort of educational activity continuing so it is essential for us societally in that way but what aspects of it are essential it has become a really interesting conversation and varying widely throughout culture and community in the states and and different different school districts different schools within school different school districts are interpreting the essential aspects of of the education differently

6:19 exactly yeah the idea of coming together I mean there’s a lot of asynchronous work that’s happening but that still takes some kind of preparation some kind of topics but there’s also a drive to have some synchronous Smith’s together to have people even if you’re not physically communicating many schools are saying but we need to have some time or people communicating in real-time with each other or not how often that is what is talked about how do you prep attendants you know do you have to be there or not grading don’t even want to start with that unless you want to but these these that is an excellent point yeah and I think I think in we really welcome all of your comments as well so if you want

7:05 to send us comments down in the chat box we’re happy to I’m trying to answer as many of those questions as we can but but it makes me think about you know what it is that we’re doing is sort of a humane study so we talk about the humanities and and I know you all have heard me talk about this before but but CS Lewis had a had a really great speech on the eve of the beginning of the Second World War and what he was grappling with was look you know there’s a there’s a there’s a horrific event that is occurring but that doesn’t mean that this essential work of trying to understand human beings better stops in in to a certain extent education is a path for us to all become more aware of our fellows more aware of our society more aware of what it means to be ourselves in that work is critically

7:53 important and doesn’t stop being important just because there are things going on that distract us from it and in a certain sense it becomes more important in that instance because the thing that we are preserving is that humanity that we all have and that’s a really powerful thing and to lose sight of that and to move away from but trying to better understand what that means is is turning to it you know sort of a darker age where we’re not you know having this having this time that we’re setting aside to really think about our own nature in the world in our place in it so that’s super meta that’s what we’re seeing right so there were some districts who prioritized the hard sciences in the in the transition right

8:40 they they focused first on rolling out what math would look like and what science would look like and they laughed English and and social studies second in that prioritization and I think that that’s a really interesting question math and it’s there there is a there is a there’s a corpus that’s very clear and that corpus is actually pretty self-explanatory in terms of laying itself out in in the systems that exist in the text books that exist there of course I was a math and science teacher as well for part of my career so obviously teachers and nuance exist in are necessary to help students with the nuance of the concepts within the maths and Sciences but I think there’s a there is a difference between the role of a

9:26 community in the in the humanities in the interpretive work right and so the the time of collaboration and kind of coming together for understanding is that much more vital in a in a in an ambiguous philosophical kind of in engagement right and so I’m wondering well the title of this webinar is like what is social studies for in a crisis or what is educated what is education in the humanities for in a crisis and I think that that CS Lewis piece was it’s very powerful and will get you the link to that in the comments or in the description but it was so powerful because he was saying that it is in many ways more essential in times of crisis

10:12 because it gives you a lens through which to interpret the current situation hmm no exactly it’s the it’s the coming together not only through distance but also over time you know I think I think it’s significant that in in putting together our discussions often we reach to people that we’ve not met through the books we read right through through not only living people but also people of the past as I was reading through trying to dig into what I think is an interesting essence of education I think it’s very similar to that I found a quote by Anthony ohhere who was a philosophy philosopher of education and his his conclusion I thought was really

10:59 interesting one that that the essence is that I’m quoting from him here to introduce the young to what elders believe is the best husband in the various forms of knowledge and experience that have been developed and I think that’s a really interesting sort of open approach to what you’re saying that that the history of Education there have been a lot of changes that have occurred and so we rather than learning fresh we’re not starting fresh every generation the idea is that you’re passing things down and that’s what social studies is is really about so is math obviously in a way but what the true stories and learnings of just the human experience being passed down is really fascinating yeah I think that’s

11:45 right and I think I think it’s important to be able to to say as well look that they they’re both equally important and they have different functions and social studies doesn’t have the same the same result that a lesson in mathematics does necessarily but that doesn’t mean it’s lesser or it doesn’t mean it’s it’s not as important it’s a different subject focusing on a different topic and I think one of the things that’s interesting to me about education is that to a certain extent education requires discipline right I mean education is work it’s something that doesn’t just it doesn’t just come to you and you don’t sit down with a book and something you know things you had to work at it you have to really dedicate yourself to the process of learning much

12:31 to the chagrin of all of us I wish I could just sleep with books under my pillow from just matrix it yeah but maybe I don’t because there is something about that that process that is rewarding and all of us who sort of work in education know that us working with students to achieve that end is rewarding and I think this has been an opportunity for us to reflect on that that discipline is we’re all having to focus and do this on our own and I saw that we have a couple comments coming in and and Christina mentioned thinking about what it means to be a part of a community in the self versus a group right and I think that’s a really powerful thing that that social studies really does help you grapple with when when and why do you sacrifice on behalf of others if we’re all sort of acting in

13:18 our own sphere we’re all really worried about what’s happening in our own homes and we’re concerned about our own families on how is it that we then make the decision to know that our community needs us to sacrifice on their behalf yeah the history of of schooling is this idea of the Civic mission of schools that right you have a duty to you’re like a community has a duty to its young people to provide opportunities to give them resources to then enter in to enter into the society alright so how are we doing that right now is a really interesting question and I think to the purpose of all of this I mean I keep talking about Plato but even even that

14:03 the you know the development of our education system is this really interesting balance of again is the purpose to develop like your internal conditions or to have an impact on your environment and the answer is probably both obviously but like what that means even and again not just social studies learning everything but social studies in particular but has the change is the purpose of this changing the individuals we’re having those intervals individuals change the outside world are obviously assume both what does that look like now and I think that’s right I think Kristin’s point about that is community and personal experience you know it that continues no matter what right and so the question becomes again like what should what should is a terrible word

14:49 and should is actually a violent word if it has judgments attached it it assumes an alternative yeah like should but like but the question is what what what is the value that we have what what are we valuing right now so that our actions in our in our space with our students will reflect those values that’s my that’s kind of the question it’s an it’s a better question than should what should we be teaching right yeah how like what are the values that we are are demonstrating right they’re students right now right and how will that influence their own

15:35 standing of the the the nature and importance of their education right there anemic I’m what we’ve been saying this like Maslow Maslow over bloom right like right there’s this idea that you have a lot of students who are in desperate conditions whose families are in desperate situations and it’s only going to get worse in the coming months in the coming weeks as the trickle effects of this the economic impact of what’s happening continues as the educational effect continues as you see universities and colleges be impacted and school board’s school district budgets be impacted so the question is how do we how do we how do we help them understand the importance of their educational experience right now

16:21 go ahead Gary gonna say exactly right that’s that’s again raising a question and beyond having an answer but part of it and and look we’re always living through time right but we’re using the word crisis and and I think that’s true that it is unusual to feel history happening every day around you you may hear of it it may have been something that occurred there referred to but for a history teacher right now it’s really happening and I noticed a comment from Hollis who said it’s an opportunity for our students to create primary sources instead of using others to learn from that’s exactly true I mean right now the act of being a historian as you are studying history it’s an interesting way

17:08 of looking at that question that you just had yeah and I think that’s what that’s what all these comments are owl girl Jacqueline Laura how are we helping our students I mean there’s just so many opportunities to connect what’s happening right now to periods in the past there are so many parallels that that help them kind of ease that tension between the now and the next moment by saying there are models that we can draw from right there are there is experience and it wasn’t maybe our experience but there is cultural experience that we can draw from there’s historical perspective that we can draw from and that’s a really so has salutary effects right adolescents are used to feeling alone they’re used to feeling like they’re the only ones that

17:54 experience things it’s part of their modality anybody who works with adolescents know like that oh it’s really important that I’m the only one that has ever experienced this thing in the history of ever and that’s part of their psychological formation and at the same time when they are put in contact with either books or ideas or other people who have had similar experiences there’s this huge sense of relief and and and kind of in their in their interpretive ability right and it gets to that again question of essential and that the details of the experience of another may be different and yet there’s what is it that makes that connection of a common experience I mean it’s not 1918 right now and yet there is a common

18:42 experience that can be touched upon that a student immediately can connect to and I really what end or what purpose is this interesting yeah I really like the phrase history rhymes I’m not as big of a fan of history repeats itself which we can dive into if we really want to but but I do think history rhymes because I think there’s there’s something about that commonality and I saw somebody mentioned enduring issues right there’s something about the commonality of the human experience that’s shaped by the context that you’re in but that is common across time particularly when we live in a similar you know governing of societal structure as others so that is looking at us history has a different context for us then does French history because we have a connection to it right

19:29 and looking at history from that perspective particularly as you’re living through this kind of moment raises a lot of interesting themes that can really be dived into one of those that we have been diving into and I saw somebody mentioned tension between the public good and and and personal good I think isn’t interesting well we’ve been talking about debates over civil liberties right and and it’s an interesting time to highlight those kinds of conversations because you’re looking at it with real pressures around you and it’s to say look there these are very hard things to balance and they’re very difficult things to get right especially when right now we will never know less than we do right now I mean as this debate goes on as time

20:14 moves forward we’re gonna be able to look back and have a lot more hindsight but right now none of us really know how this is going to end cert for certain we may have ideas about it we may have other things but thinking about what it is we’re valuing what it is we’re seeing is essential and where it is that we think safeguards need to be minded or compromised on I think it’s just a really valuable lesson because it shows you that the real-life deliberation that has to occur among citizens for a society like ours to function mm-hmm and I love this coming in from Robert that his students are thinking more deeply about social and economic aspects of life you know when when life is easy it’s it’s easy to not be critical to not be filled right and I

21:01 think I said we mentioned this in our previous the reason the Stoics developed their philosophy was because there’s a lot of hardship in life right and you need a framework to manage that hardship and maintain resiliency right and so what a lot of the historical content gives us are frameworks to manage the hardship and to understand it so we can process it and make decisions and that’s what that’s going all the way back to old positions of power but especially in democratic societies where you have you have a duty to be well informed because bad times will come and you are responsible for for the outcomes that

21:47 will occur because you are part of the process it’s not Kings on high making decisions that will affect you but you are you are part of the Democratic self-governance in that not only do you have agency and making choices about what you follow and what you don’t follow of the laws but also that you have agency and the decision in in crafting who becomes a decision-maker and so I think that there’s this again this this this duty that we have but the only way we can exercise that Duty is if we’re well informed the only way we get well informed is if we value a kind of social studies history education yeah and Duty has Duty has sort of this heavy responsibility thing to it which you

22:33 know I don’t necessarily think it does because I was thinking about another word and Gary had mentioned some Greek thinkers so I’ll mention Aristotle I forget if you mentioned him or not but but I think about the word habit because you know habits habits are something that we’re all having to form right now because we’re our lived experience is very different than it was three months ago right so I’m now working from home that required me to develop new habits but education and and I think this was part of Aristotle’s point about you know the formation of the individual you’re forming deliberate habits around education too and so thinking about and I saw Jeffrey mentioned on his students thinking about dreams and where they can go and what they can shape their lives in you know that that is a deliberate action that’s requiring sort of a vision

23:21 and building out a framework that’s going to help you achieve that I think thinking deliberately about habits and as Aristotle would refer to them virtues to a certain extent in in virtues we you know have a very particular definition of but but meaning that we’re working on those things which are helping us to achieve the ends that we wish to make right in servicing those things can be really interesting too I think because you know it’s not just again thinking about education it’s not just something we all come by you know you’ve got to deliberately turn yourself toward it and be disciplined and focused at learning about it even you know someone who’s brilliant I almost said Elon Musk but that’s probably not a great example of this but calling I’ll call I’ll Albert Einstein

24:07 right you know Einstein is brilliant but he he had to learn and learning to deliberate action and focus and I think those are things we can be thinking about now too is that that habit formation I think I think we know I’ve always a word you’re saying deliberation on so again I I I think about the kind of and I don’t want to call it an opportunity because I would never wish this situation on anyone in the world right like but I think that there’s a way to and it is the human the human spirit of resiliency and the psychology of resiliency says that that we will so we’ll get through

24:53 this if we believe we will right like what there needs to be that kind of optimism that that there will be an end to this and on the other end we will be able to come back and we will have the creativity and the energy and the entrepreneurial you know spirit to bring ourselves into a new and better future on the other side and that resiliency that delivers a deliberative Faculty of the ability to take what’s happening now analyze it make decisions that will better better inform your future activity and so again I think that there’s so much in the historical context and in the historical record that helps with that deliberation that Faculty of deliberation that will

25:39 eventually allow us to reach you know continued states of flourishing in the future absolutely and I think and I think you’re saying exactly what I was thinking of in terms of it that deliberation historically getting back to the essence of Education happening has been very organic it’s not like there was a plan that was just launched and it’s been running and now there’s a hiccup and we’re waiting to get back to that education has not stopped a day since then things got in the way there might have been a Saturday maybe where we you know just said that’s enough I was gonna go to the hammock but I mean for the most part you know the school of 2020 wasn’t the school of 15 years ago

26:27 wasn’t the school of 50 years ago was in the school of a hundred years ago school itself that concept and yet the education happens and so there’s something enduring about all of that you know that that deliberations say yeah things things have always changing right and so it’s okay to say speculate what does it look like now is time for a weird reboot of our thinking of the things that have to be part of education and things that do not have to be part of education I mean does it have does it have an end in mind or is it the habits or some combination of both how it’s what is the use and importance of measurement right so I mean there’s a lot there are a lot of a lot of

27:13 districts both states who are rethinking what measurement means in this time right rethinking what content is essential and what content is is not essential given the context of what what’s happening and will that have continuous effects will we go back into the classroom will you teachers go back into your classrooms and teach the same way you taught six months ago six months from now barring any change in the physical space so even if everyone went back physically in the building in September would you teach the same way what would change for you right what has this done to your understanding of your practice of your of your your own goals of your own

28:00 values in your own teaching teaching career yeah a major question I have is not only how teaching is changing but also how does have a student demonstration of learning changing right Howard are they in some way demonstrating if they understand something differently then they work demonstrating before just because that was the way it had been done you know is is their demonstration of understanding or – what what I’m finding really fascinating is their curiosity they’re at home a lot of the kids they’re logging in right they are still interested they are even somehow more interested in a lot of ways and so you’re right what of that will will be altered six

28:47 months from now right again like you couldn’t constraints aside it’s correct that’s another thing I mean I think that that one of the one of the barriers to learning right now is the uncertainty right so in order to have the space in our minds to do the hard work of learning because it is hard work there needs to be some sense of consistency and expectation one of the things we’re dealing with all of us as human beings on the earth right now is that our expectations are it’s it’s unclear what the future holds for the next six months to a year to two years and that’s never happened in our lifetimes and that certainly never happened in the lifetimes of 15 year olds and so I think that what what we’re

29:35 what we’re helping our students work with again reflecting back on on history is that times of uncertainty are create opportunities for this kind of reset that gary was mentioning that because we don’t know exactly what it’s gonna be we can start to we can start to imagine alternates and options and you’re seeing a lot of those kind of come out in the news like their university they’re you know 20 different options for universities right now that they’re all playing with school districts are starting to talk about what what the potential future will hold but then there’s also potential futures for society there are potential futures for them that maybe didn’t exist gap years

30:20 for graduating seniors they’re not maybe maybe that’s something that will fundamentally change in American culture maybe everyone’s gonna take a gap year like they do in Europe and Australia all right yeah I think I think it’s interesting because you know I think it underlines the uncertainty that we all live with but that we don’t always see and I mean that because you know we’ve lived at society broadly has been fairly stable for for quite some time and that’s not always the case but I think that education the importance of education becomes much more accentuated when you realize that we’re all building generation by generation the world in which we live and when that thing seems so continuous

31:08 you know the the real importance of the work that you educators are working on can sometimes the the relevance can seem a little bit further away and I think right now we’re at a moment because that that uncertainty is so immediate for us we’re really seeing the importance that comes from understanding ourselves understanding our society understanding mathematics and science but but understanding all of these things and why it is that we have to understand how it is that we relate to one another and and I think studying government comes under that understanding government requires studying history understanding history requires studying human beings I mean they all relate to each other this

31:55 really beautiful impactful way I guess I’m thinking of all this because I’m thinking of the quote from the Federalist but what is government but the greatest reflection upon all human nature and that’s what it is and I think we’re all having a moment now where we’re reflecting on what that means and in what we need to study and learn in teach in order to ensure that that were continuing to focus and think about those things and as you said before it’s even even on top of that there’s the content and again I actually thought I was gonna get a lot more reading done than I’ve been getting lately but I’m finding there is still that power of trying to come together I mean I see April has mentioned something about what we value and valuing social-emotional

32:40 learning and others talking about community I mean we chose right now to talk about it and now we’re joined by people right now who are writing in to us and watching and keep writing in because we do love the exchange but that’s an interesting part of it right we didn’t just publish something historical put it out there right which we could do that’s great we and we do that filled with books but there’s also about the coming together right and how education there’s something about that that non in a book miss at the terrible work community to to education as being also somewhat essential even if it’s not physically together well many I mean most educational theorist educational cycle that education is a social activity

33:25 right so at its root at its core education is learning from others around you how to be and that’s how to be and how to how to be in a multitude of ways but learning from others around you and and I think that that also so that’s what Jacqueline is is speaking to you that there’s this idea that that there’s the human the humanistic in impulse within education is being highlighted right now there was a there was a bit culturally of distraction when it came to the the connected part of Education and all the memes I see on all the teacher Facebook groups I’m a part of are how much we miss our students right how much

34:12 teachers miss the community of their students how much the teachers miss the community of fellow teachers right and and I think that that’s true kind of writ large among society as we do our physical distancing but it’s even more true especially for younger learners but adolescents and high school teachers because there’s something so essential about the community that’s created in the pursuit of knowledge and and how we how we continue to value that I think this is highlighting the continued value in in that that community in the pursuit of knowledge yeah absolutely and I and I see a few comments here speaking to you know social-emotional learning and I and I

34:59 think that that that speaks directly to what you’re talking about to Rachel which is how is it that we can connect with one another how is it we can support one another how is it that we can all work towards the well-being of ourselves and and of society at large right and that doesn’t that doesn’t necessitate the memorization of facts or learning about this that or the other thing it could mean just investigating ourselves and what we’re feeling and how we can speak about those things and how it is that we see the world communicating those things to us too right I mean that’s where literature can be a really powerful tool of that because it’s its exploration of of a lot of those kinds of themes in a way that you you don’t find in other avenues and that’s what I think is really beautiful about all of these different disciplines is

35:46 that they they all highlight different facets of what it means to be a human being and and it highlights you know just how complicated of creatures we really are I wouldn’t do a quick plug for those of you that don’t know we’ve been running a webinar series for students called bright and early where we actually speak to them about a lot of these issues about creativity and and our place in time right now and give them activities that they can do in little bits of historical context so if you go to our You Tube channel you can find all of our bright and early episodes we put them out weekly and those are student facing so kind of similar to what we’re doing here just not quite as philosophical and we’d love to have your students join us or you join us for those conversations as well what we do exactly those opportunities I

36:32 mean I guess I’m thinking of it because we started off that way but just like the power of the words and word choices you know and super biased because that’s what I’ve my teaching background but just even thinking social studies rights like that what does that ultimately mean short history is absolutely part of that’s right because you most people have existed prior to this but you know I’m thinking a lot about what are the essential parts of social studies in this time have we come to any kind of conclusions where are we at right now yeah that’s a good question well I don’t know but I did look up the meaning of the word studies because they all seemed kind of like I get social but what his studies really mean and the definition I found was achieved or maintained by careful and deliberate

37:18 effort which i think is is interesting and in social studies they just said the study of human society which seems kind of bland but it’s true and it is I think to a certain extent but I also think getting behind those words you really start to see how rich that becomes but yeah I don’t know if that’s a conclusion or not Gary I think I’m not I’m trying to get to it’s just we’ve had so many key ideas so far right about like our question is what is the purpose of education but social studies education in a crisis and I think every part of that questions interesting there’s the in the crisis context there’s the social studies itself there is what is education and

38:04 and so just considering oh that’s such a rich question to ask that when you were mentioning bright and early and other things in other ways of staying in touch you know I’m also thinking we’re coming together right now but I don’t want that to be the end of the conversation you know how do we continue that afterwards yeah and I think well that our YouTube channel is here so please always that whenever we have live events join us we love to talk to you but I think that this is obviously an ongoing conversation and we I mean organizationally the Bill of Rights Institute is a teacher centered organization we don’t exist without our teachers our teachers are the heart and lifeblood of everything we do so we are here to serve you wherever you are in your teaching journey as an educator of

38:50 whatever kind of educator you are so this is this conversation continues right we are nowhere near through this crisis and we are nowhere near the end of history to come well maybe those two but I think that we we we have an opportunity to continue what this has done and it’s given us the space to ask this question right I mean we don’t have a lot of extra time I think I saw a statistic that most people are working about two to three extra hours a day right there in their days yeah in the remote work world that we’re in right now so we have extra time but there’s a

39:39 difference in the kind of time we have right a lot of our extracurriculars are no more a lot of your students extracurriculars are no more and that gives us these moments of reflection that we have the opportunity to explore and I I don’t know that a year ago when we came up with topics for for our webinar we would have asked this question no we would have right and so that’s enough to me for us to continue to ask these kinds of questions and this question is not going anywhere for the next couple of years and so there is going to be the continual refinement of what our work means right now in this context and how we can better support one another yeah and I’ll just say over the next four weeks so we have two tenth period

40:26 webinars left before we sort of wrap up our semester I mean we’re going to continue to explore this topic from a couple different angles but we do hope that you’ll continue to stay tuned but also reach out to us via Facebook we’re on YouTube or or email us and we’re happy to continue to to continue this conversation or to provide you with content on that you may need so if there’s anything on that you’re trying to discuss with your students or there’s any resources that we can provide to you let us know and we’ll do whatever we can to support you in whatever way you need so yeah I think that’s a core idea that even I’ve gained for this conversation is education one of the not answers for one of things discovery is it doesn’t stop it’s not stopping for us it’s not

41:11 stopping for you all it’s not saying for anybody it may look different but it just keeps going and I think that’s that’s literally true that’s really interesting human it’s part of what it means to be a few minutes today is to learn and grow and continue continue on our way and together so one of my favorite quotes is education as an act of optimism that we do what we do because we think it’s going to improve the future and we haven’t again that word duty but that word duty is very warming to me but we have a duty as educators to just keep optimistic and to help our students see see the future is something that they can they can be a part of in a positive way so we’re so grateful to everything that you do out there in the trenches with your students

41:59 in all the variety of ways that you’re engaging with them right now and we are here for you however you need us to be so thank you absolutely so thank you all so much for joining us we really enjoyed the conversation thank you for all the comments and we’ll look forward to continuing this conversation with you thanks so much all right thanks